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Author Topic: Is The Long Term Damage To The Body From LL Worth It?  (Read 44346 times)
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danielqjohnson
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« Reply #20 on: May 05, 2013, 04:12:55 PM »

It's probably a mistake to speculate about the impact on stem cells.  That field of biology is still rather poorly understood and there could be any number of mechanisms associated with their behaviour that we just don't know about.

That said extensive surgery plus the time spent on painkillers plus the time spent lengthening is going to impose some sort of burden on the body.  The question for each individual is whether the benefits are worth it to them.
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a1_z1
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« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2013, 02:37:20 PM »

An interesting incident :

I know a strong and fit 60 year old that just went through hip surgery a couple of weeks ago. I saw his yesterday and he was in the gym already.  When I spoke to him he told me that a metal rod was stuck in his femur and the socket that attaches to the hip was also replaced. Now the amazing thing is that that is similar to LL plus he said that he was up and about literally 4 days after the surgery and in the gym 2 weeks later. He can not train his legs, can not put his socks on like he used to BUT he is working plus trains his upper body in the gym and wants to start running in a few more weeks. Plus he is a heavy guy (200 plus pounds of mostly muscle, 6 feet 1). Also his legs and hips do not seem smaller than before, he did say there was a slight reduction in size (but that was expected I suppose).
He told me that the doctor does not recommend to train and run so soon but the doctor usually deals with people who are not as fit as he is.
 He is a lawyer by the way so he is not a fitness professional. I found it amazing to see him up and about so soon even at his age. I just thought that was encouraging for us LLers.  I know LL is different but still. Look at his age and recovery......

Just thought I would share that.
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ShortsGoneWILD
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« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2013, 02:14:51 AM »

I m guessing he is lifting heavy weights so his body is used to stress.
Plus he ll probaby training for a long time.
Being fit and active is the key.
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a1_z1
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« Reply #23 on: June 25, 2013, 12:55:04 PM »

I m guessing he is lifting heavy weights so his body is used to stress.
Plus he ll probaby training for a long time.
Being fit and active is the key.

yeah I am counting on that, since I am the same way lol. even with a busy schedule I still make time for intense workouts. BUt of course you never know.
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Snortle
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« Reply #24 on: August 29, 2013, 08:17:41 PM »

Quote from: a1_z1 link=topic=6080. msg82845#msg82845 date=1372084640
An interesting incident :

I know a strong and fit 60 year old that just went through hip surgery a couple of weeks ago.  I saw his yesterday and he was in the gym already.   When I spoke to him he told me that a metal rod was stuck in his femur and the socket that attaches to the hip was also replaced.  Now the amazing thing is that that is similar to LL plus he said that he was up and about literally 4 days after the surgery and in the gym 2 weeks later.  He can not train his legs, can not put his socks on like he used to BUT he is working plus trains his upper body in the gym and wants to start running in a few more weeks.  Plus he is a heavy guy (200 plus pounds of mostly muscle, 6 feet 1).  Also his legs and hips do not seem smaller than before, he did say there was a slight reduction in size (but that was expected I suppose).
He told me that the doctor does not recommend to train and run so soon but the doctor usually deals with people who are not as fit as he is. 
 He is a lawyer by the way so he is not a fitness professional.  I found it amazing to see him up and about so soon even at his age.  I just thought that was encouraging for us LLers.   I know LL is different but still.  Look at his age and recovery. . . . . . 

Just thought I would share that.

Good story.  I am glad to read that even older guys can fully recover.
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MiracleGrow
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« Reply #25 on: November 14, 2013, 12:45:30 AM »

Hi.  I was confusion a bit confused about the reaction to soft tissues in the legs to LL.  I wanted to ask about this in a new thread, but I am new to MMT and can't start a thread yet, so I will post the source of my confusion here, as I feel this thread is the most relevant.  Here it goes:

In several diaries, I have seen LLís effect on the body compared to/called a late growth spurt in the legs.  Obviously, LL is not your typical growth spurt, and bone growth does not come from the cartilage in oneís growth plates, but the end result, as is the case with a natural growth spurt, is that the bones gradually lengthen, ideally along with the surrounding soft tissue.  Most LL patients lengthen around or less than 7CM or ~3 inches on a single segment.  Some (lucky) teenagers have natural growth spurts that result in growing 22CM (~9 inches) in a single year alone.  Dwight Howard shot up 13 inches (33CM) in a year, Jeremy Lin 12 inches, and actor Kevin Costner grew 11 inches after turning 18 years old.  Such growth means that these people probably saw around 7CM, or possibly much more, growth in each leg segment (femur and tibia) within a year, much like LLíers , but they seem to recover amazingly from their spurts (two mentioned are in the NBA), and without ballerina foot or Achilles tendon issues.  This is, of course, because their soft tissue kept pace with bone growth beautifully.  Soft tissue seems to grow along with bones during a natural growth spurt, meaning that new soft tissue is generated.  However, since many LLíers seem to have real difficulties with ballerina and the Achilles tendon, I wonder if LL generates new soft tissue, or if the existing soft tissue on our legs is merely stretched out, with little to no new soft tissue generation.  If soft tissue is only stretched out, without any new soft tissue being generated, then it would reduce in width permanently as the result of being stretched more than designed for and would always be weaker than it would be without LL, if all other variables such as level of exercise were kept constant.  However, if new soft tissue is actually generated during or after LL, there is no reason that a 100+% recovery isnít possible with time and physio.  Soft tissue regeneration isnít linked in any way to the growth plates in bones, so I donít see a reason that new soft tissue generation isnít possible after the growth plates fuse, however I am really curious as to whether it actually occurs during LL.  Either way, with enough dedication, a tremendous recovery should be possible, but itís important to understand exactly what is going on in the legs during LL. 

Any contribution and input on how this works would be greatly appreciated!
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« Reply #26 on: November 14, 2013, 12:51:37 AM »

When you lengthen your bones with mechanical means, your soft tissues stretch, and over time they adapt and your body finds its new normal.
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MiracleGrow
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« Reply #27 on: November 14, 2013, 03:06:09 AM »

Quote from: SysOp link=topic=6080. msg89116#msg89116 date=1384390297
When you lengthen your bones with mechanical means, your soft tissues stretch, and over time they adapt and your body finds its new normal.

Thanks for your reply Sysop.  The human body's ability to adapt and recover really is a force to be reckoned with! It's crazy what can be done by combining this with some cutting edge science.  As someone who was initially very skeptical about LL (but also hungry for height), I must say that I am very, very impressed by how well many LL vets have recovered.  I'm still doing my research but concede that I've already saved a lot of what I need to make this happen if I decide that I'm ready to do LL.  A big thanks for running this forum.  It's given me a ton of information and inspiration that I couldn't have found elsewhere.
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ďMan cannot remake himself without suffering, for he is both the marble and the sculptor.Ē -Alexis Carrel


"Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference." -Reinhold Niebuhr
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« Reply #28 on: November 14, 2013, 02:05:26 PM »

A big thanks for running this forum.  It's given me a ton of information and inspiration that I couldn't have found elsewhere.

That's what this site is here for, and if I can help make LL more affordable and more available along the way that will be an added bonus. Cheers.
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OneSevenOne
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« Reply #29 on: November 15, 2013, 04:50:05 PM »

That's what this site is here for, and if I can help make LL more affordable and more available along the way that will be an added bonus. Cheers.

Korea guest house???  Wink Grin
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fivefootsixguy
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« Reply #30 on: February 12, 2014, 05:35:14 AM »

If LL turns my hair gray and I look older I would be so miserable. Its topics like this that really drain the hope and anticipation from me towards my LL surgery(that is if i have one). All the things described make it seem so not worth it... I hope being young would help and if you have also never broken a bone before which i haven't maybe that may help my chances, considering i may have more stem cells than an LL patient who has broken bones before. Idk, i really just don't know.
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Colossal-Cat
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« Reply #31 on: May 12, 2014, 05:39:42 PM »

I've got 'white hairs' and I'm in my early 20's Cheesy Buuut, thats genetics, hair dye is cheap and easy compared to LL.

The stress you would otherwise endure from mental anguish over height neurosis is arguably a lot worse, compared to the varying stress encountered during LL. The original argument doesn't hold much water, without some good references with solid externally valid evidence (applicable to the general population at a significant alpha).
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muaythaiguy
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« Reply #32 on: June 19, 2014, 06:01:15 PM »

Quote from: SysOp link=topic=6080. msg80309#msg80309 date=1367235421
Tombogo, here are a few points to consider:

1.  I'm sure the discussion you were having was on a bodybuilding forum or a forum for short men, not an LL forum.  The person you were debating with seems only able to focus on the battle of LL and not the war that is the whole life of a person.

2.  While it is true that LL is traumatic to the body, it is over in a relatively short period of time considering the whole lifespan of a person.  It is much more traumatic to the body to live 30, 40, or 50 years unhappy with yourself and your life because you are not who and what you want to be.  There are many types of stress that can damage the mind and body.  A short period of physical stress on the body is much less damaging than a lifetime of mental stress.

I think this is a fair counter.
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shortkid
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« Reply #33 on: June 24, 2014, 05:50:47 AM »

Has anyone had any problems with arthritis because of LL?
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Current height 162cm
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« Reply #34 on: June 24, 2014, 07:03:43 AM »

Has anyone had any problems with arthritis because of LL?

Probably lots of people.

If you eat pineapple you can prevent it a little.
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Starting height 173cm, now confirmed 180cm. Had surgery in India January 8 -13. Did ~7cm on tibia. Frame removal: 16 April -13. 180cm wingspan. Shrunk to 179cm as my final height. Considering femurs.
shortkid
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« Reply #35 on: June 24, 2014, 07:09:41 AM »

Damn thats my one big worry is arthritis :/
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Current height 162cm
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Reinhard
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« Reply #36 on: June 24, 2014, 11:30:06 PM »

Quote from: shortkid link=topic=6080. msg97795#msg97795 date=1403593781
Damn thats my one big worry is arthritis :/
As far as I know, you only risk arthritis with internal nail methods, if you go pure external your main concerns would mainly be small pin-site infections and the psychological burden of having a huge ass frame for like 9 months.
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SysOp
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« Reply #37 on: June 25, 2014, 06:55:37 AM »

As far as I know, you only risk arthritis with internal nail methods, if you go pure external your main concerns would mainly be small pin-site infections and the psychological burden of having a huge ass frame for like 9 months.

What exactly is the source of this belief?

It's the stretching of your soft tissues from lengthening that has the potential to cause arthritis down the road, not the initial trauma from the surgery.
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MiracleGrow
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« Reply #38 on: June 25, 2014, 06:21:20 PM »

The unnatural change in the mechanical axis of your leg bones as another factor that has been theorized to increase the risk of arthritis post LL. This applies more to the femur than the tibia.
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ďMan cannot remake himself without suffering, for he is both the marble and the sculptor.Ē -Alexis Carrel


"Grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference." -Reinhold Niebuhr
amt91
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« Reply #39 on: June 28, 2014, 07:18:39 AM »

i wonder too. . . im 5'11. 5'' and want to be 6'2'' but it seems painful. 
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