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Author Topic: Leechlet - Internal Femurs - Dr. Guichet - 2014 - My Femur Lengthening Journey  (Read 203298 times)
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leechlet
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« on: October 09, 2013, 08:21:57 PM »

What up guys and gals!

Good morning! Or evening! Or whatever it may be!

Let us take a moment to reflect what a wonderful day (or night) it is to be contributing to the unique body of knowledge called limb lengthening.  Grin  Wink Shocked Roll Eyes :-*Okay, that's enough. . .

Brief About Me:
-22yo
-160-162cm
-124 lb, dropped weight from 133 lb since I started exercising for LL two month ago
-male
-Asian
-recently graduated from college
-have the money for surgery immediately due to generous parental support
-started stretching 2 month ago, and now can palm the floor with a SLR result of about 110-120 degrees and a side split of about 150 degrees
-skinny and 15% nerdy, but muscular in the legs due to lifelong cycling and recent weight jogging sessions
-citizen of USA, the land of fat, err, I meant fast food  Roll Eyes

I am getting limb lengthening with Dr.  Guichet early 2014.  The exact date of the epic battle is yet unknown, but I shall inform you, my fellow comrades, as soon as that info is available.  The reason I am making this diary is because I want to help lower the barrier of entry to getting limb lengthening by providing good information.

My diary will be a little different.  I am not going to talk about why we should get limb lengthening and stuff, because that's largely irrelevant. . .

If you are reading these words right here -- right now -- then you are clearly very interested in limb lengthening, and are probably contemplating limb lengthening yourself.  I accept whatever numerous reasons for limb lengthening there may be.  

But whatever the cause, I beseech you to wholeheartedly accept the reality that YOU are the sole captain of your ship, and that at the end of the day it is ultimately YOU who care about your height more than anybody else.  Although our realities are all unique and subjective, our experiences are all nonetheless valid.  Happiness is when reality matches our internal beliefs.  Thus, the strategy for happiness is rather simple: change our expectations or change reality itself.  

If changing your expectations and beliefs is not one of the possible outcomes, then the only thing left to do is to change reality.   Shocked Indeed, it takes a very strong willed (and perhaps stubborn) person to hold onto an expectation for so long even when reality have contradicted it time and time again.  For this reason, I applaud your for being such a determined person, and may that unique asset of yours be put to good use.  Wink

I am going to break my diary into four parts:
1.  pre surgery preparation
2.  the actual surgery, and the post trauma that immediately follows
3.  the lengthening process
4.  and eventual consolidation

Each of these phases are all equally important, just like four legs on a four legged stool.  Without preparation, we won't be able to realistically lengthen much.  The nail can elongate the whole 10cm in a day if we really wanted to, but our soft tissues such as muscle and nerves needs many month, perhaps years, to keep up.  

Thus, stretching is basically shifting the adaptation curve of our soft tissues leftwards, buying us time during the lengthening process before the stretching pain of the nail eventually forces us to stop.  Imagine running up a very long, jagged mountain in which the next step gets harder and harder than the previous.  The peak is orders of magnitudes higher than Everest.  Most people stop somewhere in the middle.  Where will you stop, I wonder?

I read many diaries where the eventual lengthening is less than the set goal.  And yet, how many of them were ANY less determined than those who have not yet undergone surgery? One thing is certain: this forum is not just a collection of people who are unhappy about height.  There are many people who are unhappy about their height or weight.  Rather, this forum is a self selected group of iron wills.  

The rational response then is to stretch and condition the body as much as possible.  Doing two month of stretching, I can attest to how boring the preparation phase may be.  It often seem like I am not doing anything, as if I am merely buying time before the inevitable hardship of the surgery.  Yet, that couldn't be further from the truth.  The surgery is only one part of the LL process, and a rather small part if measured in time alone.  Sure, it may be an important milestone.  

But the LL process really actually starts the minute you start stretching, and ends the minute you return to normal mobility (or whatever mobility you can recover to).  It's a long, long marathon in which the mental game is every bit as important as the physical and financial.

That concludes the first entry.  I am going to upload pictures of my flexibility, diet, daily schedule, stretching routines and techniques, and other details soon.  I want to fully document my experience, leaving no data behind.  I will also start a youtube channel making daily vlogs in France if there's enough interest.  All these information will be free forever, made available to anyone who have internet.  Sorry if some of the things said here are redundant, but I want to make this a standalone diary that requires almost no prior knowledge to benefit from.  

Best of luck, friends!
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"I feel that no matter what I choose to become, I believe that I can change the world. And as I am striving to change the world, I will be happy." -- Sam Berns

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« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2013, 08:28:46 PM »

Congrats on starting your journey. I look forward to another diary from a patient of Dr. Guichet. You are in good hands. Cheers. Smiley
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« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2013, 08:37:49 PM »

Congrats, leechlet!  Smiley I just had a consultation with Dr. Guichet a few days ago, met one of his patients in Milan, and currently working on my pre-op flexibility and muscle mass increase. It's highly likely that I'll be lengthening in Italy around January (unless I go to Florida - I'm still assessing my options), so hope to see you there - maybe we can lengthen around the same time? We're the same age, by the way. Would love to Skype and exchange opinions whenever you have the time.
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Starting Height: 165 cm
Final Height: 172 cm

Date of Surgery: January 6th, 2014
Started Lengthening: January 11th, 2014
Started Walking Again: March 21st, 2014
From Surgery to Walking: 75 days

Lengthened 7 cm with Dr.Muharrem Inan in Istanbul, Turkey with the Fitbone Internal Method.
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« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2013, 08:41:07 PM »

P.S: I started doing fitness and pilates simultaneously - fitness to add 40% muscle mass to my legs, especially the quadriceps, and pilates to make the hamstrings as flexible as possible, up to 120 degress (currently I can only do 90). I'm on a 1600 kcal diet daily. Let's exchange information here and keep track of our preparation phase  Wink 
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Starting Height: 165 cm
Final Height: 172 cm

Date of Surgery: January 6th, 2014
Started Lengthening: January 11th, 2014
Started Walking Again: March 21st, 2014
From Surgery to Walking: 75 days

Lengthened 7 cm with Dr.Muharrem Inan in Istanbul, Turkey with the Fitbone Internal Method.
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« Reply #4 on: October 10, 2013, 12:14:59 AM »

Hi upinthesky,

Thanks for the offer.  If I do end up lengthening the same time, we should definitely get together in France! You, and anyone else on this forum, can message me anytime or email me at: leechletll@gmail. com.  My youtube channel will also go by this email, so stay tune!

For now, I will upload a new post every Saturday, so that way you guys don't have to check every day to see whats up.  My next post is going to have detailed pix and explanation on everything I know about the science of stretching so far, with links to scientific articles to back up my research.  Also, I will upload pictures of me going through my daily stretching routines.  I will start uploading daily vlogs starting the day before I fly to France, which will be daily accounts of my activities, emotional states, experiences, etc. 

I am going to Japan with an old friend in two weeks, and will stay there for a month! Nonetheless, I'll have a computer with me and hopefully make good on my weekly posts.  After that trip, I want to get surgery as soon as Dr.  Guichet's schedule and my flexibility allows, but realistically we are looking at early 2014. 

Thank you all!  :D
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"I feel that no matter what I choose to become, I believe that I can change the world. And as I am striving to change the world, I will be happy." -- Sam Berns

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« Reply #5 on: October 10, 2013, 01:10:36 AM »

Hi leechlet,

As far as I know, Dr. Guichet is now working in Milan, Italy. Have you actually spoken with him? I didn't see him in Marseille, France - I had to go to Italy instead.
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Starting Height: 165 cm
Final Height: 172 cm

Date of Surgery: January 6th, 2014
Started Lengthening: January 11th, 2014
Started Walking Again: March 21st, 2014
From Surgery to Walking: 75 days

Lengthened 7 cm with Dr.Muharrem Inan in Istanbul, Turkey with the Fitbone Internal Method.
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« Reply #6 on: October 10, 2013, 01:58:43 AM »

Hi, no I haven't yet. I made payments today and exchanged emails. So I guess I can't be certain if I am going to get it done in France or Italy. It might be better in Italy because I read on the internet that French people don't really speak that much English, which sucks because I can't speak any other European language. Perhaps I have lucked out. Is it easier for people like me in Italy? That is, is it easier to speak english in Italy?

Also, I mentioned in your other thread that my skype is: leechletll

You can add me and chat anytime. I am looking forward to talking with you. I just finished college a few weeks ago. Thus, I didn't make any solid plans yet except get a blank check from my parents and stretch for two month. When I get back from Japan, I am going to be all LL. I want to see Guichet asap, and calibrate the information I have learned thus far as well as how flexible I am in his eyes. According to you, 80 degrees gets you about 3-4cm. In that case, I am probably looking at 5-6, maybe 7 with my current flexibility. My goal is to do a split before I get surgery. However, I noticed that it's getting harder and harder to gain flexibility as time goes on. My hamstring muscles are already burning and I walk funny immediately after stretching. I am also running or walking around every day to get the bloods circulating to my legs for faster healing, but I think my muscle fibers are adding new segments as fast as it can. But if I can get a SLR of 140-160 degrees in 3-4 month, I think that's more realistic.
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"I feel that no matter what I choose to become, I believe that I can change the world. And as I am striving to change the world, I will be happy." -- Sam Berns

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« Reply #7 on: October 10, 2013, 04:24:10 AM »

Guichet no longer operates in France....it's been quite a few months now.
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Sometimes, you have to take a leap of faith.  The trust part comes later.
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« Reply #8 on: October 10, 2013, 05:58:21 AM »

Hi, Man of Steel, thank you for notifying me that Guichet no longer operates in France. As I've said before, I just graduated from college and the only thing I know for certain right now is that: 1) my parents will pay for the entire surgery and 2) I have been preparing for it for about two month now. I already paid for a consultation. I hope that since I already started preparing for it, that Guichet will allow me to undergo surgery early next year.

The following are a few pictures of my progress with stretching. When I first started studying limb lengthening seriously about three month ago, I learned very quickly that being flexible was paramount to success. However, I wasn't that flexible when I first begin. For starters, I couldn't even touch my toes. It wasn't even pain. Rather, it was simply extremely uncomfortable to a point where I just couldn't do it. So I started stretching on my own. But it wasn't easy. Two weeks into my stretching routine, I seriously thought about giving up. Coupled with the pain diaries here detailed, I wonder if I could achieve enough gain for it to be worth the time and money. However, I stuck to it and also read up on the science of stretching.

Below are a few articles I found helpful:
http://www.mit.edu/activities/tkd/stretch/stretching_2.html#SEC5
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23049683

I especially like the MIT website. You can find many other similar articles online. But basically, how I understand it is that short term stretching doesn't do anything. But prolonged and repeated stretching will cause tears in your muscle fiber, and when new muscle fibers are added via sarcomerogenesis the muscle --> elongates. The tendons and such cannot lengthening, only the muscles can adapt by lengthening. BUT this process takes a very long time, which means it's crucial to start early, send consistent signal to our body to adapt day after day, and eventually the muscle will undergo the desired change.

I stretch for about 30min to 2 hours every day, broken up into one or two sessions. Sometimes, I skip a day or two due to exams or just laziness. But overall, I've been pretty good about stretching every day. I paid for private yoga lessons in the US for about 30-40 dollars an hour from Craigslist. At first, I benefited from these private lessons. It was much more fun to stretch with a girl in a park than on my own. Also, they (yoga mkt is competitive) were able to diagnose where I was most inflexible and where I was most flexible. All in all, I was pretty flexible in my quads, as I can completely bend backwards and lie on my back. My calves also didn't need much work. Most of my inflexibility resided in my hamstrings.

Below are a few stretches I do daily that specifically target the hamstring:










The most useful stretch I learned from yoga was the triangle series. Is that the accurate name? Anyways, basically you bend forward with your legs spread apart slightly wider than shoulder width and progressively bring your feet closer together. It gets harder and harder as your feet gets closer, but just try to relax and open up your hamstring. I am able to palm the floor now. Also, I like to do this stretch against the edge of the bed, leaning into your toes and again opening the hamstring. I found that having a game on or listening to music really help the time pass as you stretch.

Below are a few pictures of side split stretches:




Basically, the idea is to lean your legs against a flat surface such as a wall or bed, and let gravity slowly open up your side splits. Again, a game tablet helps tremendously here, especially one that doesn't require a lot of thinking such as Baloon TD5 or Poker, something that simply allows time to pass less painfully.

Finally, here is my little brother doing SLR for me, one for each side. I am not sure what degrees that it, but it looks to be 120? Anyways, let me know what you guys think in the comment below!




I keep a stretching table on the wall to keep track of how many stretching sessions I do, and how many days I skip I also keep track of the exercises I do. Let me know if you guys want a copy of the spreadsheet I made.
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"I feel that no matter what I choose to become, I believe that I can change the world. And as I am striving to change the world, I will be happy." -- Sam Berns

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« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2013, 06:41:46 AM »

Does anyone know why Guichet has moved to Italy?
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« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2013, 07:33:07 AM »

Hello Jens,

I presume Guichet moved to Italy due to law reasons. In France
a doctor's liability is very high. This aspect is hardly ever brought up
during the LL discussions, but in fact it is one of the most important
ones. Therefore e.g. the doctors in the US play it very save in comparison
to some doctors overseas. This is also the main point in the
discussion whether a nail is weightbearing or not. Simply ask
the question who has to carry the risk.

Best regards

Wotan
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upinthesky
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« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2013, 10:04:18 AM »

Hey leechlet,

Your stretching capability already looks amazing. Congrats. I'll add you and perhaps we can Skype this Friday.
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Starting Height: 165 cm
Final Height: 172 cm

Date of Surgery: January 6th, 2014
Started Lengthening: January 11th, 2014
Started Walking Again: March 21st, 2014
From Surgery to Walking: 75 days

Lengthened 7 cm with Dr.Muharrem Inan in Istanbul, Turkey with the Fitbone Internal Method.
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« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2013, 10:50:08 AM »

Hello Jens,

I presume Guichet moved to Italy due to law reasons. In France
a doctor's liability is very high. This aspect is hardly ever brought up
during the LL discussions, but in fact it is one of the most important
ones. Therefore e.g. the doctors in the US play it very save in comparison
to some doctors overseas. This is also the main point in the
discussion whether a nail is weightbearing or not. Simply ask
the question who has to carry the risk.

Best regards

Wotan

But it seems to me like he's been operating in France for quite a long time, so what's with the sudden move? Changes in their laws maybe?
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exploring the dark side


« Reply #13 on: October 10, 2013, 01:06:08 PM »

Hello Jens,

That's a good point. The French law for plastic surgery is from 2002. Therefore we can only guess
what happened. The best way to find out would be to ask him directly.

Best regards

Wotan
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« Reply #14 on: October 10, 2013, 03:29:53 PM »

Way to go Leechlet! This is going to be an awesome diary!

Why aren't you doing your tibiae?
Does anyone at all do their tibiae using internal methods? I know of a handful of diaries here that are internal tibiae.
I've always had a feeling that tibiae will be a lot more comfortable than femurs since it isn't anywhere close to your back and bum.
(but yeah, there are 2 bones to be cut if you did the tibiae, and you don't recover as fast)
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« Reply #15 on: October 10, 2013, 03:45:46 PM »

Way to go Leechlet! This is going to be an awesome diary!

Why aren't you doing your tibiae?
Does anyone at all do their tibiae using internal methods? I know of a handful of diaries here that are internal tibiae.
I've always had a feeling that tibiae will be a lot more comfortable than femurs since it isn't anywhere close to your back and bum.
(but yeah, there are 2 bones to be cut if you did the tibiae, and you don't recover as fast)


Internal femurs are the safest and fastest thing to lengthen. Unfortunately, they are also the most expenisve. Using external fixators with LON is actually a very good way to lengthen tibias. Internal tibia lengthening has some additional risks and it is generally more expenisve than internal femurs. No part of leg lengthening is "comfortable" and all types have various risks that should be considered.
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« Reply #16 on: October 10, 2013, 06:57:26 PM »

Okay, people!

Guichet just emailed me personally! Below are his words, except my name is edited out:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BEGIN
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Your e-mail was forwarded to me by LLC.

I am waiting return of your paperwork and passport.

Beofre any consideration of the possible date, I need to understand your needs:
- Do you want to come, do training (one month intensive training to tune you for the surgery with my professional team) and get surgery in a row?, or
- Come for the consultaiton, go back to your country for training then come back for surgery?
- What is the period you would like for surgery?
- What is your hight and the target realistic gain you would like?

The consultation will be in Milano, the surgery too.

Yours sincerely,

Jean-Marc Guichet, MD, PhD, Doct. Sci.
SELARL du Docteur Jean-Marc Guichet
Centre Phocea, 14 Bd Ganay
13009 Marseille - France
Office: +33.491.777.547
Office (mobile): +33.664.163.890
Fax: +33.491.777.547
E-Mail: mbbsecretaire@gmail.com
Web: www.allongement-os-grandir.com

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
END
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also, his staff members have me two separate emails, one from about a month ago, and one from today, 10/10/2013.

Below are their two emails in chronological order:

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BEGIN - EMAIL 1
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for your inquiry. It would be our pleasure to help you. The first step is to do an initial consultation with Dr. Guichet. Although you have been stretching and exercising on your own, Dr. Guichet insists on meeting all of his patients for an initial consultation before going any further. This way he can assess you, determine if you are a good candidate for surgery, and let you the next steps you will have to take to prepare for the surgery.
 
The cost of a consultation is 305, which can be paid via paypal on our website. Once we have received payment, we will send you a receipt, which you need to provide at your consultation for proof of payment. Then we will send you the administrative paperwork to complete and send back to us before your consultation.
 
Please let us know if you have any further questions.
 
Warm Regards,
 
LL Clinic
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
END
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BEGIN EMAIL 2
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We have received your payment. Please find your receipt attached. Keep this receipt as you will need to use it as proof of payment when you go to your consultation in Milan.  We will let Dr. Guichet know that you are looking for an early December date, and let you know as soon as we have one for you.
 
Please find the paperwork you must complete attached. Please complete and send back to us ASAP so we can confirm your consultation date. You will also need to send a copy of your passport for identification purposes.
 
Let us know if you have any questions.
 
Warm Regards,
 
LL Clinic
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
END
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Along with the email, they also sent four pdf attachments:
1) receipt
2) disclaimer
3) motivation letter assignment (to be graded by Dr. Guichet himself  Cry )
4) a long form asking questions from your medical condition, to your psychological state, etc. 13 pages long total. it feels like going to a doctor's office, here they give you a bunch of papers to fill out on a clipboard. I only uploaded a few pages because the document is very long. Let me know if you guys want more.

Below are attachments of all paperwork except my receipt:






Finally, I would like to ask you guys what I should do. I am already reasonably flexible, and would like to continue training on my own for at least a month more. I am confident I can do splits or very close to it prior to my consultation late early December to early January. I dedicated many hours understanding the science of stretching, and developing my own techniques. However, I do not want to risk putting off the surgery for TOO long.

Therefore, I think I am going to reply to Dr. Guichet saying that I want to do training with his team, but please have him also put my prior training into consideration. I'll also give him a link to this post so that he can get a sense of where I am in terms of flexibility. Perhaps a compromise could be made, in which I only need to train for a few weeks with his team. If any of you know what the price of training with his team is, please let me know. I am going to speak to my parents prior to emailing Dr Guichet back.

Also, it seems that he wants to do the consultation and surgery in Milano. According to wikipedia, it is the second largest city in Italy with massive suburban sprawl and culture. I shall also ask him why the change from France to Italy, and relay that answer back to you ppl as soon as I get it.

Okay, that's all folks. Peace out comrades!
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"I feel that no matter what I choose to become, I believe that I can change the world. And as I am striving to change the world, I will be happy." -- Sam Berns

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« Reply #17 on: October 10, 2013, 07:03:25 PM »

PS. I just noticed that Dr Guichet have a lot of misspelled words in his email, whereas the ones from his staff have perfect spelling and grammar? Is he on vacation, I wonder? He sent me that email two hours ago, which means he sent it around 7:00 PM local time in Milian. Was he at dinner, and simply punched a quickly reply on his smart phone before his meal arrived? Anyways, just thought I add this to be consistent with my no detail left behind philosophy. 
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« Reply #18 on: October 10, 2013, 08:15:46 PM »

You're doing some stretches very wrong. I will tell you a little better tomorrow. I'm in a hurry and just saw this update.......
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Starting height 173cm, now confirmed 180cm. Had surgery in India January 8 -13. Did ~7cm on tibia. Frame removal: 16 April -13. 180cm wingspan. Shrunk to 179cm as my final height. Considering femurs.
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« Reply #19 on: October 11, 2013, 02:01:13 PM »

I've heard that patients undergoing operations must sign a letter along the lines of "The doctor is not responsible for anything that can go wrong with you". Are you sign such a letter separately? I could find one that effect in the pics you posted.

What are the "laws" regarding LL? They say they aren't responsible for the laws in your country. What laws could exist?

It's great that they ask your religion. Looks like everyone is given special care there.
(*wonders if they have a vegetarian option there  Huh?)
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